Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

tgjensen
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Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:46 am

Having nearly reached level 200 (198 at the moment), I decided that my current setup with an augmented Hellfury, while very nice, was a bit too bland and cookie-cutter for me, and I wanted to try a configuration that would set me a bit more apart from all the other 200 froob soldiers I see running around.
All two of them. None of which use hellguns... but still.
As I'd come across a pair of Revolving Cold Lasers earlier while farming token guns, and having tried them at around level 160-175 until I switched back to AR again, I decided I wanted to see what they could do in an endgame setup, taking advantage of all the gear that is accessible to us there. So I came up with the following setup:

http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=169685

I started making the switch at level 197 when, with the gear in my posession at the time, the guns became equippable self-buffed. At present I'm lacking only the Anything before the setup is complete.

Short of running a few team missions I haven't really tested the guns much yet. Here they perform well, with a high damage output that beats an Augmented Hellfury, but not quite, according to auno's damage calculator, a pair of BBBs. At 200 I will have about 1280 AR self-buffed, and a bit over 1300 if I can cast FAT.
The setup definitely has some projected downsides; due to the lack of specials I went with a crit-setup to take advantage of the high crit bonus as a compensator. This necessitates a full Agg-stance to reach 1/1, which would make the guns not great for soloing dynas. Similarly the low minimum damage would make the guns less suited for high AC mobs than a Hellgun would be.
To overcome the last hurdle (and maybe the first as well) I had a pair of QL167 Sleekblaster - C05 made; Against most mobs the damage is rather low, but switching to energy damage rings, the high minimum damage, coupled with the 1/1 attack/recharge speeds and high MBS means I can dish out decent amounts of damage against those mobs that would reduce me to min damage on the RCLs, and at a 38% AggDef setting. Capping burst at 9s and Fling shot at about 6-7s also means that these guns are plain fun to use :D. I ran the numbers on auno's damage calculator again, and it seems they should outperform the hellguns in such a scenario, provided that the AR difference doesn't make too much of a difference in my hit rate. As I said though, this is very much all theoretical as I haven't had much chance to test and compare the guns outside of normal missions yet.

Questions, comments and suggestions would be welcome!
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

Briandmg
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Briandmg » Mon Jan 24, 2011 7:07 am

Wow impressive. Never thought that any froob could ever use a 100% RE dependent weapon. The closest RE weapon I've ever used myself was a sleekmaster classic. I guess the only thing missing from your build would be a http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=129656 :P Now you can kill cenobite shadows as a soldier!
The Ultimate Endgame Froob PvP Guide :OO
All you ever needed to know to make your L200 froob toon a beast in PvP. :P

WeeScotsman
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by WeeScotsman » Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:16 am

How does this setup do against a 200 froob trader who doesn't use his drains on you at all? :wink:

tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:13 pm

About as good as you'd expect :x
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:07 am

Setup has been updated to reflect the changes I've gone through over time. I now sport a Revolving Cold Laser plus a Blinded Blackbird for maximum damage against most regular mobs. I have ~1300 Attack Rating with the RCL and about 1170 with the BBB, discounting towers and contracts. It's been a very satisfying setup. Between Bursts and crits I can do great damage, and I have some degree of flexibility as I can change to dual BBBs or Sleekblasters for a more defensive stance as required. High evades/AAD also makes for good soloing capabilities. Recently I've taken part in a few raids where I've beeen required to tank, and I've begun to feel the urge to tweak my setup into a more accomodating style. It does well for DD at least, so we'll see...
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

Lusto
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Lusto » Sat Aug 20, 2011 9:23 pm

I ran my little damage dumper on our yesterdays small run to see how your setup does. Targets were from easy side but this is how it looks:

Professor van Horn
Carrion, dmg: 261888 hits: 239
Burst 28% of damage with 25 hits of 1680-3969 average 2951
Fling Shot 3% of damage with 9 hits of 301-2727 average 797
cold 17% of damage with 65 hits of 299-1096 average 696
cold (crit) 17% of damage with 16 hits of 2702-2847 average 2731
energy (nano) 0% of damage with 4 hits of 1-1 average 1
radiation 25% of damage with 66 hits of 464-1500 average 974
radiation (crit) 10% of damage with 15 hits of 1724-1724 average 1724
reflect shield 1% of damage with 39 hits of 49-49 average 49

Mick 'Nugget' McMullet
Carrion, dmg: 135341 hits: 128
Burst 22% of damage with 13 hits of 869-3040 average 2324
Fling Shot 4% of damage with 6 hits of 344-2797 average 961
cold 19% of damage with 35 hits of 346-1151 average 747
cold (crit) 21% of damage with 10 hits of 2797-2797 average 2797
energy (nano) 0% of damage with 3 hits of 1-1 average 1
radiation 20% of damage with 32 hits of 479-1130 average 853
radiation (crit) 13% of damage with 12 hits of 1426-1426 average 1426
reflect shield 1% of damage with 17 hits of 49-49 average 49

I must admit that I am surprised how well that base cold damage compares to the BBBs radiation damage. I never considered ranged energy as viable weapon. But unfortunately it also says that you could go for dual wielding BBBs without losing much and thus simplifying your setup a lot.

Would be interesting to see how the crit setup aspect works on high AC mobs.
Lusto (level 200 doc) Lostu (level 200 adv) Losto (level 200 MP) Lustu (level 199 Soldier)
Lyrangitus (level 100 Trader) Lyran (level 74 Agent) Lyrangitis (level 25 Doctor)
Froob Since 2005, Member of Wolf Brigade, Founding Member of Froob200

tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:41 am

Thanks for the input. It's nice to put some concrete percentages on the different sources of damage. However, the numbers seem a little deceptive; if you compare the crits from the two mobs it's easy to see that Van Horn must have a radiation AC hole, skewing the results (I'll keep that in mind next time we pay him a visit). You'd have to look only at the McNugget results for a fair comparison.

As for going for dual BBBs: Well, I already do this whenever I need the defensive stance :) I can swap guns at will, so I can mix and match between my two RCLs, BBBs and C05s. You are right of course that I could simplify my setup a great deal by committing to one set of guns. I could also implant a shiny nano skill cluster in the head, which would alleviate the casting a bit (I can do FAT with my current towers and two buffguns equipped; without the towers I had to swap a few pieces of armor as well, though I don't know how that would work out now), but then I'd lose a great deal of flexibility as I would either have a lower attack rating (BBBs), be stuck in a 100% aggressive stance (RCLs) or run around with a pair of guns that have too low max damage to be of much use outside of raids (C05s). Not to mention the benefits of changing between damage types whenever I run into a dyna with damage shields.
And really, the whole motivation behind the initial switch form dual RCLs was that I didn't see a need for a simple setup when I could just tweak a complex one to work even better :D

What program are you using? I'd like to do some more testing, to get a bigger data pool to draw conclusions from.

*Edit: For the sake of completion: Without my current towers / org contracts, I would need a buff gun to cast OS. I would be 11 points short in PM and 55 points short in SI of casting FAT, so more than just buff guns would be needed to reach that nano. Furthermore, I would have 697 points in MC, which would just enable me to cast TMS X - so I couldn't do it without the Fly Catcher Specs or some other buffer. Hooray for towers?
Last edited by tgjensen on Sun Aug 21, 2011 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

Lusto
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Lusto » Sun Aug 21, 2011 6:01 am

I see you know what you are doing :-).

I use my own script to parse log files. You ca get it from my org web site. Use the one in first post of the thread.

http://wolf-brigade.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1484
Lusto (level 200 doc) Lostu (level 200 adv) Losto (level 200 MP) Lustu (level 199 Soldier)
Lyrangitus (level 100 Trader) Lyran (level 74 Agent) Lyrangitis (level 25 Doctor)
Froob Since 2005, Member of Wolf Brigade, Founding Member of Froob200

Saribaldes
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Saribaldes » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:18 am

I want to share a little secret related to ranged energy skill (I dont know if it is really a secret but maybe it could be an useful tip for who hasn't found this out yet).

I once wanted to equip a couple of ql 200 C05 weapons on my lvl 200 solitus soldier and, considering I have no towers, no orgs contracts, no Mutated Eremite Foetus and some other buffing items, reaching 1335 ranged energy was a really difficult struggle for me. I was giving up when suddenly I noticed that the LR Energy Weapon Expertise stacks with the Composite Ranged Expertise so I got 20 more skill points and in the end I managed to put the weapons on :) .

Unfortunately I didn't have an added damage gear so those weapons weren't so effective and I ahd to go back to hellfury/hellspinner. In any case if a player manages to get all the proper items (dchest and so on) ranged energy is a very good end game choice for soldiers. Just for example check the data from this tl5+ raid post: if you look at the 3rd reply you will notice that Nemezzida, a soldier with ranged energy+added damage equipment did a lot more damage than Saribaldes, i.e. me, i.e a soldier with hellpsinner.

regards

tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:53 am

holy crap, you're right :shock:
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

Sferykal
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Sferykal » Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:12 pm

(Going slightly off-topic, but only slightly:)

There are two ways to deal good damage on high AC targets: Having high min damage or having high crit damage. Former is best boosted by add damage equipment, latter by proper +crit chance gear, but it will also benefit from the add damage equip, naturally. High AR and high weapon special skills are also a benefit and depending on the target can have quite some impact on the overall performance. In the usual past level 200 team missions the ACs go up to like 5-6k, about, which should give you an indication of how good/bad a setup will perform there in terms of damage output.

Comparing setups is always a nice way to see how you can improve. Pulling absolute facts from that is something I would be very careful about, though, because there are too many factors involved.

Additional note: On a raid like Mister K. it's good to have at least one soldier using a Hellspinner, just to provide an additional reflect shield hole puncher for the radiation damage guys, which includes all the CoH weapon users. Maybe you do less damage than other soldiers, but the overall benefit is maybe larger than the damage dumpers show.

Additional note #2: I swap between Hellfury and Hellspinner, just to "optimize" the damage output somewhat. Sidekicks of bosses are usually better handled with the Hellfury as are and some (pre-)bosses. For example, the first waves at HI I stick to the Hellfury, later on I use the Hellspinner on the bosses and much later on I completely stick with Hellspinner.

But now, back to RE setups; nice to see them put to use with success! :D
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tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:40 am

Sferykal wrote:Additional note: On a raid like Mister K. it's good to have at least one soldier using a Hellspinner, just to provide an additional reflect shield hole puncher for the radiation damage guys, which includes all the CoH weapon users. Maybe you do less damage than other soldiers, but the overall benefit is maybe larger than the damage dumpers show.
I actually went out there with a Neutrino Flash equipped to support a 220 MA friend of mine who took Kronillis on. That's one soldier almost giving up on doing any proper damage, but that way the whole raid force benefits :D
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

LT
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by LT » Fri Sep 09, 2011 2:48 pm

Saribaldes wrote:I noticed that the LR Energy Weapon Expertise stacks with the Composite Ranged Expertise so I got 20 more skill points and in the end I managed to put the weapons on :) .
Whoa! It does? I spent quite some time trying to get all the buffing-gear needed way back... but never got quite to the point of being able to equip them. Maybe it's time to give this a shot if I manage to find everything again ;).

tgjensen
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by tgjensen » Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:51 pm

Aaand done. I upgraded the final implants tonight, the setup is the link in the original post and my signature. I really can't think of anything else to improve the setup, so I think Carrion is pretty much all finished. He's geared for raids and soloing, sporting a pair of Sleekblaster - C05s that are 1/1 at a fully defensive stance with capped burst and fling shot cycles. He's got 1354 attack rating self-buffed and hits for 842 minimum damage per shot (typically also the only damage he hits for), and can self cast all nanos up to Full Automatic Targeting (swapping on a QL200 Ring of Presence, QL187 Lya's Sangi Glasses and a 1/5 Cloak of the Reanimated Ranger) without towers or organisation contracts.

All in all I am very pleased with his performance and versatility.
Carrion level 200 Soldier
Piroth level 200 Nano-Technician
Ianney level 200 Bureaucrat
Gerbil level 200 Enforcer

Lusto
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Re: Level 200 Ranged Energy Setup

Post by Lusto » Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:34 am

This is the most impressive soldier template that I have seen. I hate myself for overlooking this setup, I tried upgraded pistols and gave up, but failed to realise that RE is just like upgraded pistols with Burst added. Which makes them worthy weapon to use.

I think the main "defect", if you wan't to call it like that, in this setup is iGoC, if we ignore the AAO/AAD boost. With your damage the crit modifier from iGoC is on average equal to about 9 add dmg, Barrow Strenght is +15 so it would increase your dps by whopping 0.7%! Another thing that you could consider is Metallic Mantis helmet and boots. It would give you similar AAO/AAD to damage trade-off. All combined you could get about +20 to your dmg (+2%) with loss of 50 AAO. I agree, most of the time you don't want to make this trade off, but that could cost you a top spot in raid damage list!

Edit: iGoC suffers ever more because crit doesn't affect the Burst at all while add damage is perfect with it. Going for more add damage could effect much more than that +2%, perhaps even 5%!!!

Of course I know that you don't have Barrow Strength, which gives me the pleasure of inviting you to join me and Saavick when we next time visit ToTW and cry by it for items we want from there for our mains.

I assume you change the reflection braclet by occasion. I would use melee bracelet as detaulf choise. Projectile damage is very rare by my experience.

This is a setup worth being proud. It is definatelly among the best end-game templates. Also it is perfectly implemented by getting all those unique items, some of witch are very difficult to get. Graz!
Lusto (level 200 doc) Lostu (level 200 adv) Losto (level 200 MP) Lustu (level 199 Soldier)
Lyrangitus (level 100 Trader) Lyran (level 74 Agent) Lyrangitis (level 25 Doctor)
Froob Since 2005, Member of Wolf Brigade, Founding Member of Froob200

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